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PostPosted: Wed December 27th, 2017, 23:17 GMT 
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Excellent review/synopsis BobFan.

And real good point on both Let’s Keep It & Rise.
Also, Believe, disc 1: “underwater” drums, ha ha.

Must admit, haven’t finished chompin’ on everything in the box yet.
Probably won’t ever view the dvd, but at least it’s here.

All in good time...


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PostPosted: Thu December 28th, 2017, 00:18 GMT 
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To follow up on Bobfan, I thought I'd offer my thoughts about 2 months on from release:

- The 1981 concert is the weak point of the package for me, which I find kind of shocking. That's my favorite year of the three documented here, but I wonder if that hinders my appreciation for the curated approach. Earl's Court '81 is probably my least favorite part of the year, and that residency got better as it went. I suspect the choice is down to the influence of Clinton Heylin, who adores these shows, along with the brevity of the show and the (apparent though unstated) intent to offer songs that weren't already circulating in high quality. If the consequence of avoiding easy picks like New Orleans, Houston, Avignon and others was picking a middling '81 show, I can't complain when we have access to the other stuff for free.

- The other portion that I listen to less frequently is the Rare and Unreleased discs. The '78 rehearsals are cool, and I'm glad they're included for historical context, but I don't find myself listening to them often. I do wish that more had been included from the Shot of Love sessions, because what's offered is so compelling. On the other hand, this early take of "Shot of Love" and the version of "Watered Down Love" here fall pretty short of the eventual versions included on the released album, so maybe I'm just being hopelessly optimistic. The biggest surprise to me is how good the Slow Train Coming outtakes sound - I like "Ye Shall Be Changed" here more than I used to, and the performances of "When He Returns" and "Gotta Serve Somebody" are every bit the equal or better of the ones selected for the album. I'm a touch greedy for more of the horn rehearsals too, if I'm being honest, and would accept the '78 tracks getting cut to have alternate tour rehearsal versions of "Ye Shall Be Changed," "Covenant Woman" and "Solid Rock" (the former apparently rewritten in 1980 and the latter two played with the horn section in rehearsal!). Oh well... I imagine that if these weren't picked, they likely didn't work as well as the three horn songs selected for Trouble In Mind.

- The opening two discs are excellent, and I'm hard-pressed to find a blemish on them aside from the 1981 "Solid Rock" (more on that later). Unlike others, I actually love the version of "I Believe In You" picked for this set, despite not typically liking its pre-'81 outings. "Do Right To Me Baby," "Man Gave Names To All The Animals," and "In The Garden" are all songs I've tended to skip on bootlegs but which shine here - it seems the curators picked what are easily the best renditions I've heard. "Gonna Change My Way of Thinking" is among the most revelatory tracks on the set for me, surprisingly, as it's pretty much the only version I've liked before the song's 2003 re-write. Including two versions of "Gotta Serve Somebody" is a bold choice, but it works because the two arrangements are so different; I don't find the same to be true of "Solid Rock," if only because the 1981 version feels woefully under-rehearsed and shambolic. It's easily the low point of these two discs, and I rather wish it could have been swapped for "Cover Down, Pray Through" or "I Will Love Him."

- The mixes on Discs 1-4 are much more satisfying on headphones, eh? Toronto stands up to car listening, but I find that much of the subtlety is lost on Discs 1-4 when playing them on a car stereo. This seems like it should go without saying, but I generally find Dylan's material to translate very well to a non-headphone setting. Trouble No More might be unique in his catalog for working so much better on headphones.

- Toronto (Discs 5 and 6) is a masterpiece, and my favorite part of Trouble No More. I'm a little surprised that this is the case, since I tend to prefer 1979 and 1981 to 1980 on the bootlegs, but the greater ability to mix this for professional release improves the sound profile tremendously. That wouldn't be a big deal if Dylan's performances were appreciably weaker than the surrounding years, but they aren't; rather, his singing and the band's playing is at least as good on these tracks as on the first two discs of Trouble No More. I'm glad that his crew thought to record these shows and not some of the shakier ones earlier in 1980.

- If I had my way, I'd probably have nixed the 1981 concert and used the extra space for a spare disc of live tracks from throughout 1979-1981 [most of which would be drawn from Discs 3 and 4, along with greater representation for Fall 1980] and a spare disc of studio outtakes to round out two solid discs of studio/rehearsal material. This ends up being 3 discs of live 1979-1981, 3 discs of studio outtakes and rehearsals, and 2 discs documenting the Toronto residency. Still, this feels kind of like quibbling when I love the set so darned much. I don't think I'd have as many suggestions if 1979-1981 wasn't my favorite live Dylan era.

- I still haven't watched the DVD!!! What am I doing?


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PostPosted: Thu December 28th, 2017, 01:24 GMT 
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More excellence. Thanks for that Seb.
You & Fan are helping me put some of this back in the spinner for another roll.

And apparently I’m not the only one not looking at at a dvd I own! Ha!


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PostPosted: Thu December 28th, 2017, 06:37 GMT 
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bobfan wrote:
Yonder Comes Sin(btw is this a few seconds longer than the circulating version? Seemed to me like there was a line at the very end I was unfamiliar with)

Yes, there are two circulating versions. One with the last verse included, the other with the final verse left out. This is the longer (original) version.


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PostPosted: Thu December 28th, 2017, 13:08 GMT 

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belleseb32 wrote:
To follow up on Bobfan, I thought I'd offer my thoughts about 2 months on from release:

- The 1981 concert is the weak point of the package for me, which I find kind of shocking. That's my favorite year of the three documented here, but I wonder if that hinders my appreciation for the curated approach. Earl's Court '81 is probably my least favorite part of the year, and that residency got better as it went. I suspect the choice is down to the influence of Clinton Heylin, who adores these shows, along with the brevity of the show and the (apparent though unstated) intent to offer songs that weren't already circulating in high quality. If the consequence of avoiding easy picks like New Orleans, Houston, Avignon and others was picking a middling '81 show, I can't complain when we have access to the other stuff for free.
I still haven't watched the DVD!!! What am I doing?


I think the issue with Earls Court is similar to most concerts from that tour. You have absolutely incendiary versions of songs like: Serve Somebody, Slow Train, I Believe In You, When You Gonna Wake Up, alongside very pedestrian versions of older material like: Ballad Of A Thin Man, Forever Young, Blowin' In The Wind, Just Like A Woman et al, which, even in 1981, were starting to outstay their welcome in the set lists. Having said that Like A Rolling Stone still sounded great, as did Mr Tambourine Man. If you then add in the weaker songs from Slow Train like Man Gave Names..., and Shot Of Love, Lenny Bruce, Watered Down Love, and Dead Man (no matter how impassioned Dylan sounds on this, the song always leaves me cold) it makes for a very uneven concert in my opinion. I'm still glad they released a 1981 concert, and one that wasn't already circulating in anywhere near this quality, but I think any of the criticisms of this gig also apply to New Orleans and Avignon (which may not be complete; doesn't Slow Train cut on the circulating tape, and Tambourine Man is missing?).
Watch the DVD, it's great! Just far too short...


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PostPosted: Thu December 28th, 2017, 13:46 GMT 
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bobfan wrote:

I think the issue with Earls Court is similar to most concerts from that tour. You have absolutely incendiary versions of songs like: Serve Somebody, Slow Train, I Believe In You, When You Gonna Wake Up, alongside very pedestrian versions of older material like: Ballad Of A Thin Man, Forever Young, Blowin' In The Wind, Just Like A Woman et al, which, even in 1981, were starting to outstay their welcome in the set lists. Having said that Like A Rolling Stone still sounded great, as did Mr Tambourine Man. If you then add in the weaker songs from Slow Train like Man Gave Names..., and Shot Of Love, Lenny Bruce, Watered Down Love, and Dead Man (no matter how impassioned Dylan sounds on this, the song always leaves me cold) it makes for a very uneven concert in my opinion. I'm still glad they released a 1981 concert, and one that wasn't already circulating in anywhere near this quality, but I think any of the criticisms of this gig also apply to New Orleans and Avignon (which may not be complete; doesn't Slow Train cut on the circulating tape, and Tambourine Man is missing?).
Watch the DVD, it's great! Just far too short...


I think you might be right about 1981. I suspect I'm falling victim to having primarily listened to my own compilations of that year, which of course give an unduly good impression - I wouldn't pick anything but my favorite songs, of course! Come to think of it, I don't think I've listened to a 1981 concert straight through in years. How about that?


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PostPosted: Thu December 28th, 2017, 18:00 GMT 

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I only listen to the more 'famous' recordings; Avignon and New Orleans ( Houston doesn't come close to those two for me) , and I don't bother with any audience recordings from that year because the poor sound quality is more than I'm willing to endure! They're both great in very different ways (previous criticisms notwithstanding), and Earls Court is a welcome addition. Hopefully we'll get more concerts from this tour released further down the line...By far my most played songs from Trouble No More are the '81 versions of Slow Train and Gotta Serve Somebody. Dylan's vocals on these are phenomenal. 'There's a slow traaaiiiiinnnnnn coming'!


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PostPosted: Thu December 28th, 2017, 20:07 GMT 

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The high point for me is easily Toronto, as a few others have said. I also agree it is not just about the recording quality--it's about the quality of performance compared to '79: the backing singers are less rabid and Dylan is mellower, less waspish. The '79 vocal grates at times.

Boy, were the Saved songs repetitive, musically and lyrically. Only a great performance can redeem them, and Toronto does it best.

Earls Court initially disappointed, and I would still prefer a Toronto treatment, drawn from multiple shows during the European residency, such as Olso. That said, it has grown on me. The performance is less "professional" at times than I remember it being--might be my own false memory of the tour, though.


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PostPosted: Fri December 29th, 2017, 08:14 GMT 

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The Gospel According to Zimmerman: "Trouble No More" The Bootleg Series Vol. 13/1979-1981

Michael Fremer | Dec 28, 2017

https://www.analogplanet.com/content/gospel-according-zimmerman-trouble-no-more-bootleg-series-vol-131979-1981


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PostPosted: Fri December 29th, 2017, 11:25 GMT 
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Can only afford the 2 disc set (however, just seen that iTunes is offering a £50 set as a download, with the rest of the boxset tracks included, which seems like a great alternative).

I wasn't really expecting any great revelations on this set - the bootlegs from 79-81 are numerous and have been widely available for decades, so genuine surprises I thought would be few. I was sort of right, there's nothing (perversely) revelatory about this release. I knew already that this was a great period for live Dylan, and this set just further confirms it without yielding any shocking surprise moments of greatness.

However, it is nice to have these songs in an admittedly superior audio fidelity. I will go back to this set - it's convenient, well-conceived and takes the trouble out of putting together my own personal best-of the Gospel era, which I've always had to do in the past.

As someone else mentioned - the 'I Believe in You' chosen for this set strikes one as an odd choice, very much a warts n' all performance, and, as such, rather a-typical.


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PostPosted: Sat December 30th, 2017, 17:56 GMT 

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I just listened to the circulating boot of 20.04.1980 Toronto ,and it's a shame that: a. They didn't include Dylan's speech before Solid Rock. As these things went this isn't the most out there of his born again pronouncements (in other words he doesn't sound totally mad) and there's the nice shout out to Ronnie Hawkins. Also, before Slow Train the organ player plays the melody of Amazing Grace that makes an effective counterpoint before the band launch into Slow Train.


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PostPosted: Sun December 31st, 2017, 06:09 GMT 
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After a brief re-connection with TCE and Live '66, I came back to TNM and still find myself loving it and finding surprises.
A quibble however is compulsory and mine is the relative over-looking of the "Musical Retrospective" tour.
I went back and listened to all the concerts in that tour recently and it's amazing how it grows from a shaky start. You can really hear Bob coming back to life (ironically).


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PostPosted: Tue January 2nd, 2018, 05:12 GMT 
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Is it just me, or is that A.J. Weberman I hear chiming in on the Portland Radio Spot (Deluxe Edition, Disc 4, Track 05)?

"I was kinda disappointed. I wanted to hear rock 'n' roll. Rock 'n' roll! I heard Bob Dylan singing gospel... I didn't come here to hear sermons; I could-a went to church man!"


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PostPosted: Tue January 2nd, 2018, 10:55 GMT 
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Bejitto wrote:
Is it just me, or is that A.J. Weberman I hear chiming in on the Portland Radio Spot (Deluxe Edition, Disc 4, Track 05)?

"I was kinda disappointed. I wanted to hear rock 'n' roll. Rock 'n' roll! I heard Bob Dylan singing gospel... I didn't come here to hear sermons; I could-a went to church man!"

No W's voice is much more low register (& faintly reminds me of Howard Stern's voice, funnily enough).
I don't think Weberman would've made the cut anyhow :p


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PostPosted: Tue January 2nd, 2018, 13:28 GMT 

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My only quibble on the first two discs is that they selected a version of "In the Summertime" with a flubbed lyric, which to my mind is a no-no for compilation albums; it may be inevitable if you are attempting to preserve a full show for posterity, but there are many pristine versions of this song from this year, and there is nothing about this one that to my ears justifies its inclusion despite Bob's errors. Otherwise these two discs are the highlight of the set for me -- I was a little surprised after first seeing the tracklist that these two discs of seemingly randomly compiled live tracks were being offered as the standalone release, but now it makes perfect sense to me. An excellent overview of the era.

Discs 3 and 4 are a bit "hodge-podge"-y, as seems their intent, and as expected there are high spots and less exciting moments. I bemoan the absence of the previously circulating "Carribbean Wind" outtake more than I do "Let's Keep It Between Us" -- I am forever at odds with whether I'd prefer these sets to offer us truly new material or preserve in the best possible quality the best of what we already know is out there, and especially since these discs cap off at about an hour apiece, it seems like in this case we could have had the best of both worlds. I also wish the B-side version of "Trouble in Mind" was here, really making it a gathering of stray tracks as much as an unearthing of new material. The highlight of these discs for me are the uptempo first take of "Gotta Serve Somebody" and the live "I Will Love Him," maybe the most joyous song from this period and the only of these live-only tracks that seems like maybe it should have made a record. I also really dig the studio outtake of "Ain't No Man Righteous" -- that song in general has really made an impression on me by way of this set.

Toronto is wonderful, and long overdue for official release. The '81 show wouldn't have been my personal pick from the year, but it's still a good show, and again, '81 was a long overdue addition to the canon. Dylan really did pick up steam just a few days later, though -- for some great, lesser-known gems from '81, check out Stockholm (the only "She Belongs to Me" from the tour), and Birmingham (an immortal "Barbara Allen").

Lastly, I couldn't care less about the omission of the sermons. They were novel once upon a time, but for years I've skipped over them to get to the music. I believe the curators wisely understood that after a listen or two they would become dead weight to the playlist, particularly on the compilation-style discs.

Overall it's a superb set, with any instances of nitpicking seeming inevitable with a release comprised of so many "choices" (as opposed to "Basement Tapes," "Cutting Edge," and "Live '66," which were all more or less mass-dump projects).


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PostPosted: Tue January 2nd, 2018, 20:17 GMT 

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Allow me to be the umpteenth person making a request and say that if you have the San Diego material in a downloadable file, I can (and should!) be reached at [url]nickn328@gmail.com[/url]. I'll reward you with a dramatic reading of your favorite passage from Chronicles, or something.


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PostPosted: Wed January 3rd, 2018, 03:30 GMT 
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I've been trying to find where all the content on the DVD originates from, but haven't come across any posts online, so here's what I've gathered that might be relevant (and maybe someone else will come along and have the answer already):

- The NY Times [*1] mentions What Can I Do For You? is from Kleinhans Music Hall in Buffalo.
- Rolling Stone [*2] mentions the movie "includes rare and previously unseen footage captured at Dylan's Toronto and Buffalo, New York concerts from late April and early May, 1980."
- According to Bjorner [*3] he played Massey Hall there on April 17/18/19/20, 1980, and Kleinhans Music Hall on April 30 and May 01, 1980.
- Bjorner mentions that many of the songs from 1980-04-19 are "available as work tape for the unreleased live album SOLID ROCK."
- Bjorner mentions that video of When He Returns from 1980-04-20 was "released complete on the DVD GOTTA SERVE SOMEBODY -THE GOSPEL SONGS OF BOB DYLAN, Columbia Legacy CK 89015, 24 March 2003."

The DVD Chapter Markers are as follows:

Trouble No More - A Musical Film:

01 - 00:00:00.000 : "Jesus Met The Woman At The Well"
02 - 00:01:27.287 : Main Open
03 - 00:02:18.105 : "Are You Ready?"
04 - 00:04:44.050 : Hypocrisy
05 - 00:06:37.230 : "Solid Rock"
06 - 00:10:12.145 : Virtue Part 1
07 - 00:11:42.235 : "Slow Train"
08 - 00:16:10.369 : Virtue Part 2
09 - 00:18:01.547 : "When He Returns"
10 - 00:22:43.829 : "Precious Angel"
11 - 00:26:24.049 : Temperance
12 - 00:28:23.702 : "Saved"
13 - 00:32:21.206 : Gluttony
14 - 00:34:15.320 : "Do Right To Me Baby (Do Unto Others)"
15 - 00:37:31.516 : Justice Part 1
16 - 00:39:46.150 : "Ain't Gonna Go To Hell For Anybody"
17 - 00:42:35.620 : Justice Part 2
18 - 00:43:25.169 : "What Can I Do For You?"
19 - 00:47:50.434 : Prudence
20 - 00:50:25.089 : "Pressing On"
21 - 00:54:29.833 : "Abraham Martin And John"
22 - 00:57:26.476 : Credits

DVD Extras:

23 - 00:00:00.000 : "Shot Of Love"
24 - 00:04:48.355 : "Cover Down (Pray Through)"
25 - 00:09:17.624 : "Jesus Met The Woman At The Well"
26 - 00:12:25.812 : "Ain't Gonna Go To Hell For Anybody" Complete Version
27 - 00:16:36.062 : "Precious Angel" Complete Version
28 - 00:21:55.881 : "Slow Train" Complete Version

Players (according to the credits):

Guitar: Fred Tacktett
Bass: Tim Drummond
Drums: Kim Keltner
Keyboards: Spooner Oldham
Piano, Vocals: Terry Young
Choir: Clydie King, Mona Lisa Young, Mary Elizabeth Bridges, Gwen Evans, Regina McCrary

Copyrights:

Written by Richard Holler, Copyright 1968 Regent Music Corp
- Abraham, Martin And John

Traditional Arranged by Bob Dylan, Copyright 1973 Special Rider Music
- Jesus Met The Woman At The Well

Written by Bob Dylan, Copyright 1979 Special Rider Music
- Slow Train; When He Returns; Do Right To Me Baby (Do Unto Others); Precious Angel; What Can I Do For You?

Written by Bob Dylan, Copyright 1980 Special Rider Music
- Are You Ready?; Solid Rock; Saved; Ain't Gonna Go To Hell For Anybody; Pressing On; Every Grain Of Sand

From the above chapters:

[02] is similar to the Paramount Radio Spot from the Deluxe Edition, Disc 4, Track 05, but uses different fan reactions (two are the same)
[04, 06, 08, 11, 13, 15, 17, 19] are all newly filmed sermons acted alone by Michael Shannon. No Dylan content whatsoever.
[22] is the Credits. The music that plays over it is the Every Grain of Sand rehearsal from the Deluxe Edition, Disc 4, Track 15.
[01, 07, 10, 16] are incomplete versions of 25, 28, 27, 26, with content cut for time constraints.

[01] has the on-screen title "Rehearsal Studio, Los Angeles, CA, 1980".
[01/25 and 21] appear to be from the same Rehearsal Studio; Dylan is wearing a sleeveless leather vest and a white pirate shirt.
[03, 05, 07/28, 09, 10/27, 12, 14, 16/26, 18, 20, 24] have Dylan and the entire band wearing the same clothes, suggesting the same venue. The same camera angles are also used throughout.
[09, 20] have some additional camera angles, but this because Dylan is at the piano. He and the band are still seen wearing the same clothes.
[23] has Dylan and the entire band wearing different clothes from all other songs. The camera angles are also different.


Next I compared against the relevant released tracks for Toronto and Buffalo, which would be:
- Disc 2, Track 08: Are You Ready [Buffalo]
- Disc 4, Track 06: Cover Down, Pray Through [Buffalo]
- Discs 5-6 [Toronto]

Of these, the only two tracks that seem to match the ones on the DVD are Disc 5, Tracks 05 (When He Returns) and 09 (Precious Angel).
According to Bjorner, Precious Angel was played at all 4 Toronto shows and both Buffalo shows. However, When He Returns was only played at the April 20 show in Toronto.

Based purely on the above, I would make the following assumptions:
- Because When He Returns has to be from April 20th, and because of the clothing and camera angles, almost everything on the DVD is from the April 20th show in Toronto, except for the 2 rehearsal songs (Jesus Met The Woman At The Well and Abraham, Martin And John), and Solid Rock from the DVD Extras. This would also mean many of the songs on Discs 5 and 6 can be further whittled down as to their correct date between the 4 Toronto shows.

- The NY Times is wrong in mentioning What Can I Do For You? is from Kleinhans Music Hall in Buffalo.

- While Solid Rock was played at all 4 Toronto shows and both Buffalo shows, since multiple articles mention the footage is from Toronto and Buffalo, the version of Solid Rock on the DVD Extras is probably from one of the Buffalo shows.

- The only Rundown Studios dates Bjorner mentions are 1980-09-23 and 1980-10, both in Santa Monica, CA, and neither of them mention Jesus Met The Woman At The Well or Abraham, Martin And John. I don't know where to date these from.


Now, the few things I can think of that would make the above wrong:
- If statements that the songs are from Toronto / Buffalo were incorrect to begin with.
- If the footage is not necessarily from the same source as the songs. However, the singing seemed to match up pretty well to the video when I watched, except for a couple short spots where they had a close-up of Dylan's face and the syncing seemed to be off.
- If Dylan and the entire band wore the exact same clothing on multiple nights.


Unfortunately I don't have the boots for any of the 6 shows to further compare against. But maybe someone else already has and this was a waste of my time =)


[*1] https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/01/arts ... -more.html
[*2] https://www.rollingstone.com/music/news ... ng-w510772
[*3] http://www.bjorner.com/DSN05570%201980% ... 20Tour.htm


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PostPosted: Wed January 3rd, 2018, 03:53 GMT 
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Bejitto wrote:
I've been trying to find where all the content on the DVD originates from, but haven't come across any posts online, so here's what I've gathered that might be relevant (and maybe someone else will come along and have the answer already):

- The NY Times [*1] mentions What Can I Do For You? is from Kleinhans Music Hall in Buffalo.
- Rolling Stone [*2] mentions the movie "includes rare and previously unseen footage captured at Dylan's Toronto and Buffalo, New York concerts from late April and early May, 1980."
- According to Bjorner [*3] he played Massey Hall there on April 17/18/19/20, 1980, and Kleinhans Music Hall on April 30 and May 01, 1980.
- Bjorner mentions that many of the songs from 1980-04-19 are "available as work tape for the unreleased live album SOLID ROCK."
- Bjorner mentions that video of When He Returns from 1980-04-20 was "released complete on the DVD GOTTA SERVE SOMEBODY -THE GOSPEL SONGS OF BOB DYLAN, Columbia Legacy CK 89015, 24 March 2003."

The DVD Chapter Markers are as follows:

Trouble No More - A Musical Film:

01 - 00:00:00.000 : "Jesus Met The Woman At The Well"
02 - 00:01:27.287 : Main Open
03 - 00:02:18.105 : "Are You Ready?"
04 - 00:04:44.050 : Hypocrisy
05 - 00:06:37.230 : "Solid Rock"
06 - 00:10:12.145 : Virtue Part 1
07 - 00:11:42.235 : "Slow Train"
08 - 00:16:10.369 : Virtue Part 2
09 - 00:18:01.547 : "When He Returns"
10 - 00:22:43.829 : "Precious Angel"
11 - 00:26:24.049 : Temperance
12 - 00:28:23.702 : "Saved"
13 - 00:32:21.206 : Gluttony
14 - 00:34:15.320 : "Do Right To Me Baby (Do Unto Others)"
15 - 00:37:31.516 : Justice Part 1
16 - 00:39:46.150 : "Ain't Gonna Go To Hell For Anybody"
17 - 00:42:35.620 : Justice Part 2
18 - 00:43:25.169 : "What Can I Do For You?"
19 - 00:47:50.434 : Prudence
20 - 00:50:25.089 : "Pressing On"
21 - 00:54:29.833 : "Abraham Martin And John"
22 - 00:57:26.476 : Credits

DVD Extras:

23 - 00:00:00.000 : "Shot Of Love"
24 - 00:04:48.355 : "Cover Down (Pray Through)"
25 - 00:09:17.624 : "Jesus Met The Woman At The Well"
26 - 00:12:25.812 : "Ain't Gonna Go To Hell For Anybody" Complete Version
27 - 00:16:36.062 : "Precious Angel" Complete Version
28 - 00:21:55.881 : "Slow Train" Complete Version

Players (according to the credits):

Guitar: Fred Tacktett
Bass: Tim Drummond
Drums: Kim Keltner
Keyboards: Spooner Oldham
Piano, Vocals: Terry Young
Choir: Clydie King, Mona Lisa Young, Mary Elizabeth Bridges, Gwen Evans, Regina McCrary

Copyrights:

Written by Richard Holler, Copyright 1968 Regent Music Corp
- Abraham, Martin And John

Traditional Arranged by Bob Dylan, Copyright 1973 Special Rider Music
- Jesus Met The Woman At The Well

Written by Bob Dylan, Copyright 1979 Special Rider Music
- Slow Train; When He Returns; Do Right To Me Baby (Do Unto Others); Precious Angel; What Can I Do For You?

Written by Bob Dylan, Copyright 1980 Special Rider Music
- Are You Ready?; Solid Rock; Saved; Ain't Gonna Go To Hell For Anybody; Pressing On; Every Grain Of Sand

From the above chapters:

[02] is similar to the Paramount Radio Spot from the Deluxe Edition, Disc 4, Track 05, but uses different fan reactions (two are the same)
[04, 06, 08, 11, 13, 15, 17, 19] are all newly filmed sermons acted alone by Michael Shannon. No Dylan content whatsoever.
[22] is the Credits. The music that plays over it is the Every Grain of Sand rehearsal from the Deluxe Edition, Disc 4, Track 15.
[01, 07, 10, 16] are incomplete versions of 25, 28, 27, 26, with content cut for time constraints.

[01] has the on-screen title "Rehearsal Studio, Los Angeles, CA, 1980".
[01/25 and 21] appear to be from the same Rehearsal Studio; Dylan is wearing a sleeveless leather vest and a white pirate shirt.
[03, 05, 07/28, 09, 10/27, 12, 14, 16/26, 18, 20, 24] have Dylan and the entire band wearing the same clothes, suggesting the same venue. The same camera angles are also used throughout.
[09, 20] have some additional camera angles, but this because Dylan is at the piano. He and the band are still seen wearing the same clothes.
[23] has Dylan and the entire band wearing different clothes from all other songs. The camera angles are also different.


Next I compared against the relevant released tracks for Toronto and Buffalo, which would be:
- Disc 2, Track 08: Are You Ready [Buffalo]
- Disc 4, Track 06: Cover Down, Pray Through [Buffalo]
- Discs 5-6 [Toronto]

Of these, the only two tracks that seem to match the ones on the DVD are Disc 5, Tracks 05 (When He Returns) and 09 (Precious Angel).
According to Bjorner, Precious Angel was played at all 4 Toronto shows and both Buffalo shows. However, When He Returns was only played at the April 20 show in Toronto.

Based purely on the above, I would make the following assumptions:
- Because When He Returns has to be from April 20th, and because of the clothing and camera angles, almost everything on the DVD is from the April 20th show in Toronto, except for the 2 rehearsal songs (Jesus Met The Woman At The Well and Abraham, Martin And John), and Solid Rock from the DVD Extras. This would also mean many of the songs on Discs 5 and 6 can be further whittled down as to their correct date between the 4 Toronto shows.

- The NY Times is wrong in mentioning What Can I Do For You? is from Kleinhans Music Hall in Buffalo.

- While Solid Rock was played at all 4 Toronto shows and both Buffalo shows, since multiple articles mention the footage is from Toronto and Buffalo, the version of Solid Rock on the DVD Extras is probably from one of the Buffalo shows.

- The only Rundown Studios dates Bjorner mentions are 1980-09-23 and 1980-10, both in Santa Monica, CA, and neither of them mention Jesus Met The Woman At The Well or Abraham, Martin And John. I don't know where to date these from.


Now, the few things I can think of that would make the above wrong:
- If statements that the songs are from Toronto / Buffalo were incorrect to begin with.
- If the footage is not necessarily from the same source as the songs. However, the singing seemed to match up pretty well to the video when I watched, except for a couple short spots where they had a close-up of Dylan's face and the syncing seemed to be off.
- If Dylan and the entire band wore the exact same clothing on multiple nights.


Unfortunately I don't have the boots for any of the 6 shows to further compare against. But maybe someone else already has and this was a waste of my time =)


[*1] https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/01/arts ... -more.html
[*2] https://www.rollingstone.com/music/news ... ng-w510772
[*3] http://www.bjorner.com/DSN05570%201980% ... 20Tour.htm



No other words - amazing!
When my family tells me I am too obsessed with Dylan, I will have them read this.
That's not a dig - I really am impressed!


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PostPosted: Wed January 3rd, 2018, 05:09 GMT 
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Really wish you could edit posts here...

I found 1980-04-20 in the Rare Recordings, and a quick comparison showed me these are definitely not all from the same show. Will research more tomorrow and see if I can find the other dates.


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PostPosted: Wed January 3rd, 2018, 09:25 GMT 

Joined: Tue December 30th, 2008, 09:05 GMT
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Location: Liverpool
When He Returns is definitely from the 20th. The video circulates widely (probably even on youtube) so it's easy to identify performances from that date. I'd probably watched this particular performance a number of times so it was immediately recognizable. A number of the other performances definitely do not.


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PostPosted: Wed January 3rd, 2018, 10:09 GMT 
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Bejitto wrote:



Thank you, mate.

Precious stuff.
Saved, printed and inserted in my deluxe box.
Thanks.


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PostPosted: Wed January 3rd, 2018, 11:11 GMT 

Joined: Thu September 20th, 2012, 23:49 GMT
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Sometimes the background singers suddenly change positions during the song (i.e. Solid Rock), which indicates the video is from multiple shows.


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PostPosted: Wed January 3rd, 2018, 12:15 GMT 

Joined: Tue January 13th, 2009, 19:20 GMT
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From Anders Lindh in the last issue of « The Bridge » (thanks to him) :

16th October 1980 Rundown Studios, Santa Monica
Jesus Met the Woman at the Well
Abraham, Martin and John

Are You Ready Toronto 20th April
Solid Rock Buffalo 30th April
Slow Train Toronto 20th April
When He Returns Toronto 20th April
Precious Angel Toronto 19th/20th April
Saved Buffalo 1st May
Do Right To Me Buffalo 30th April/1st May
Ain’t Gonna Go Buffalo 1st May
What Can I Do Buffalo 30th April
Pressing On Buffalo 1st May

Bonus
Cover Down Toronto 19th/20th April
Shot Of Love Avignon 25th July 1981


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PostPosted: Wed January 3rd, 2018, 12:39 GMT 
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Yes, "Pressing On" is definitely from Buffalo, May 1. I got all those shows on bootleg and a so-fast version of "Pressing On" was played at Buffalo!


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PostPosted: Thu January 4th, 2018, 04:29 GMT 
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gepetto wrote:
From Anders Lindh in the last issue of « The Bridge » (thanks to him) :

16th October 1980 Rundown Studios, Santa Monica
Jesus Met the Woman at the Well
Abraham, Martin and John

Are You Ready Toronto 20th April
Solid Rock Buffalo 30th April
Slow Train Toronto 20th April
When He Returns Toronto 20th April
Precious Angel Toronto 19th/20th April
Saved Buffalo 1st May
Do Right To Me Buffalo 30th April/1st May
Ain’t Gonna Go Buffalo 1st May
What Can I Do Buffalo 30th April
Pressing On Buffalo 1st May

Bonus
Cover Down Toronto 19th/20th April
Shot Of Love Avignon 25th July 1981



Awesome, thanks. I found the boots for both the April 20 (LB-6746) and April 30 (LB-07176) shows, and verified that's what listed above for those two is correct. Avignon is also correct and it's already on Disc 2, Track 10.

As for the three shows listed with multiple dates, I compared the lyrics with the two shows I had:

Precious Angel Toronto 19th/20th April
- Definitely NOT April 20th
- DVD vs LB-6746...
- First chorus: "Shine your light, on me (x3)" vs "Shine your light, shine your light on me (x3)" April 20th)
- "Telling him about a-Buddha" vs "Telling him all about Buddha"
- Other differences, but the above two are enough

Do Right To Me Buffalo 30th April/1st May
- Definitely NOT April 30th
- DVD vs LB-07176...
- Most verses have their lines sung in completely different orders and lots of points with different phrasing.
- Really easy to tell these aren't the same, no need for examples.

Cover Down Toronto 19th/20th April
- Really close, but definitely NOT April 20th
- DVD vs LB-6746...
- "If you quicken your mortal body, then let it run to your head" vs "then a-let it run to your head"
- "Well you got an image of yourself" vs "You got an image of yourself"
- Extended vs shorter ending


Now I wonder if anyone figured out the Toronto dates for Discs 5 & 6...


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