Expecting Rain

Go to main page
It is currently Thu November 23rd, 2017, 07:41 GMT

All times are UTC




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 33 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Alcohol
PostPosted: Wed September 27th, 2017, 14:19 GMT 
Titanium Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat January 3rd, 2009, 15:19 GMT
Posts: 8343
Location: Desolation Row
In agreement, Chrome Horse. Especially with your pot/alcohol conclusion!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Alcohol
PostPosted: Wed September 27th, 2017, 14:31 GMT 
Titanium Member

Joined: Wed February 16th, 2005, 21:50 GMT
Posts: 5028
Location: New Hampshire
gibsona07 wrote:
In agreement, Chrome Horse. Especially with your pot/alcohol conclusion!


Thanks.

It's big issue for me, and the main point of my legal pot argument - how can pot be against the law when it is infinitely safer, and not deadly or addictive, like the legal hard drug alcohol?

And you're in Scotland? Wow, I'm jealous!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Alcohol
PostPosted: Wed September 27th, 2017, 15:37 GMT 
Mercury Member
User avatar

Joined: Thu July 10th, 2008, 15:11 GMT
Posts: 11540
Location: brighton uk
I'd go further, frankly, and say that the daily use of good quality heroin is far less harmful to the health than alcohol. Forget the fact of addiction; that in itself won't kill you, just enslave you.

Maybe that's not the point - people seek different things, and get different things, from the same drug. Some seek oblivion, some seek refuge, some seek relaxation. You can't always get what you want. Sometimes you get what you didn't want, or expect.

Personally I've found that I drink far less when I'm taking cocaine than when I'm not, which is unusual - most people drink more. The medical fact is that the combination of coke and booze metabolises in the liver to produce a third compound which is really deadly, so I guess I'm pretty lucky.

Over the last couple of years I've pretty much mellowed out regarding drugs in general, maybe it is an age thing. I don't actually enjoy pot very much, unless it is good quality hashish, or Jamaican weed, certainly not the hybrid 'skunk' rubbish, which I condemn completely on so many levels I should write a book about it. I was a confirmed dope smoker for decades, and never thought I'd say "no thanks".

A wise Iranian guy once told me that he didn't understand why young people in the west took drugs - they are for 'old people' he said.... 'when you are old and have done most of your life's work, then sit back, and relax with some opium, it takes away the aches and pains, is good for the lungs and for digestion.... but wasteful for the young.'

Booze is by far the worst thing I've ever overdone (and tobacco) and nearly killed me twice, with acute pancreatitis... oddly my liver function is fine. Every now and then I get down and grab a bottle, but it just takes you further down.... frankly you can't beat fresh air, and as many people i know with emphysema say, oxygen is the best thing of all, you just don't appreciate it 'til you ain't got it.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Alcohol
PostPosted: Wed September 27th, 2017, 15:57 GMT 
Titanium Member

Joined: Wed February 16th, 2005, 21:50 GMT
Posts: 5028
Location: New Hampshire
slimtimslide wrote:
I'd go further, frankly, and say that the daily use of good quality heroin is far less harmful to the health than alcohol. Forget the fact of addiction; that in itself won't kill you, just enslave you.


Exactly right. That's why maintenance programs where people are given small doses daily, works, and people don't die. They work and lead fairly normal lives.

Percocet is a wonder drug for a lot people, enabling them to rise above pain and work etc.
The abusers, of course, are creating the problems, as always.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Alcohol
PostPosted: Wed September 27th, 2017, 16:12 GMT 
Mercury Member
User avatar

Joined: Thu July 10th, 2008, 15:11 GMT
Posts: 11540
Location: brighton uk
I disagree - the law causes the problems, People abuse, or not, regardless of legislation, as shown by the alcohol industry which is 'legit' - abusers have problems, they are not the cause but the effect.

EDIT - I think we are probably on the same page here, but our perceptions may be different - good to talk, regardless, thanks.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Alcohol
PostPosted: Wed September 27th, 2017, 17:17 GMT 
Titanium Member

Joined: Wed February 16th, 2005, 21:50 GMT
Posts: 5028
Location: New Hampshire
slimtimslide wrote:
I disagree - the law causes the problems, People abuse, or not, regardless of legislation, as shown by the alcohol industry which is 'legit' - abusers have problems, they are not the cause but the effect.

EDIT - I think we are probably on the same page here, but our perceptions may be different - good to talk, regardless, thanks.


What I meant was the abusers cause the laws to get worse, which they do. The opiate crisis in America right now is going to cause a clamp down, and people who need the drugs will have a harder time getting them.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Alcohol
PostPosted: Wed September 27th, 2017, 18:18 GMT 
Mercury Member
User avatar

Joined: Thu July 10th, 2008, 15:11 GMT
Posts: 11540
Location: brighton uk
I'm not quite sure what you mean. To my mind, under law, anyone who takes an illegal drug is by definition an abuser. You cannot, legally, use heroin except by strictly supervised prescription, therefore if you do so without a prescription you are 'abusing' it. This is semantics, not reality.

If you mean that those who have a problem with drugs, rather than those who use them to alleviate symptoms other than addiction, such as pain prior to or during surgery, should be proscribed (not prescribed) and punished, then I have to ask myself if you understand addiction.

As I see it, the only people who gain from the illegality of any drug are those who profit from their sale, or profit from their prohibition - in most cases gangsters or politicians (often one and the same, as it happens). If free access via prescription to ones substance of choice is given, then quality control (the most frequent cause of death) can be assured, the concept of 'glamour' goes out of the window, and peoples personal medical needs can be monitored and assisted. Penalising people for a state of being - addiction - is not only unworkable, but morally insane.

Of course I agree that certain substances are of great medical value, and ideally would be used only within that context - where that leaves booze and tobacco is anyones guess! But in truth people do, and always will, seek out some form of euphoria, relief, escape, recreation, or whatever in substances they may not actually medically require (though addiction is certainly a definition of requirement). "I need a drink" - really? If so, let's see your prescription.....

I get the feeling you may be saying that the, for example, amputee who urgently needs some morphine, is having their supply endangered because of addicts...as if the addicts are causing a legal clampdown. If I'm misinterpreting you then I sincerely apologise, but if that is what you mean then I think you need to look at it from an entirely different angle. The opiate crisis is caused by several factors - supply is only one of them, and by no means the most important. If you don't want, or need, a drink of beer then a whole swimming pool of the stuff won't be of any interest to you, will it?

I'd also cite the whole 'medical marijuana' scenario as a very silly compromise - what about "The right to get stoned"? Of course there are medical applications, but should they be the exclusive reason for using pot?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Alcohol
PostPosted: Wed September 27th, 2017, 18:35 GMT 
Titanium Member

Joined: Wed February 16th, 2005, 21:50 GMT
Posts: 5028
Location: New Hampshire
By abusing, I mean overdosing.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 33 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2

All times are UTC


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group