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PostPosted: Sun January 28th, 2018, 22:41 GMT 
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We are due for another original Bob Dylan album!
Do you agree?

Just did a quick assessment of the facts since 1990:
- 38 total releases by Dylan, Inc., since 1990
- only 6 albums of original songs released, since 1990
- 6/38 = 16%
- Therefore, only 16% of the releases since ‘90 are original material!
- The last original release was in 2012.

Here’s what’s come out since 1990
(originals in Bold Red)

2017 BS13 - Trouble No More 1979-81
2017 Triplicate
2016 Live in Sydney 1966
2016 The Real Royal Albert Hall 1966 Concert
2016 Fallen Angels
2015 50th Anniversary Collection 1965
2015 BS12 Cutting Edge 1965-66
2015 Shadows in the Night
2014 50th Anniversary Collection 1964
2014 BS11 - Basement Tapes Complete
2014 30th Anniversary Deluxe
2013 50th Anniversary Collection 1963
2013 BS10 - Another Self Portrait
2012 50th Anniversary Collection 1962
2012 Tempest!
2011 In Concert Brandeis University 1963
2010 BS9 - Witmark Demos 1962-64
2010 Original Mono Recordings
2009 Christmas in the Heart
2009 Together Through Life!
2008 BS8 - Tell Tale Signs
2007 Dylan (compilation)
2006 Modern Times!
2005 Best of Bob Dylan
2005 BS7 - No Direction Home
2004 BS6 - Love 1964
2002 BS 5 - Rolling Thunder 1975
2001 Love and Theft
2000 The Essential
1998 BS 4 - Live 1966
1997 Time Out of Mind!
1995 MTV Unplugged
1994 Greatest Hits 3
1993 World Gone Wrong
1993 30th Anniversary Concert
1992 Good As I Been To You
1991 BS 1-3 - Rare & Unreleased 1961-91
1990 Under the Red Sky!


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PostPosted: Mon January 29th, 2018, 00:02 GMT 

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I hope there will be more originals, but the way you put things above is quite revealing. He seems to be entering a more retrospective phase of his career. Given the stage he is at and the unique amount of unreleased quality material he has available to him, maybe we shouldn't raise our expectations too highly.


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PostPosted: Mon January 29th, 2018, 14:43 GMT 
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Don Was says he worked on something with him recently so, I imagine something New is coming soon.


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PostPosted: Mon January 29th, 2018, 15:05 GMT 
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make that 6/40 = 15%, as you have not listed two of the very best releases by Dylan, Inc. since 1990

Bob Dylan ‎– Live 1961-2000 ~ Thirty-Nine Years Of Great Concert Performances
Released: 28 Feb 2001

Bob Dylan ‎– Pure Dylan: An Intimate Look At Bob Dylan
Released: 21 Oct 2011


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PostPosted: Mon January 29th, 2018, 15:33 GMT 
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goodnitesteve wrote:
Don Was says he worked on something with him recently so, I imagine something New is coming soon.

Yeah, that and the Ireland thing and a few other tidbits of info
is what spurred this thread to fruition.
Seems inevitable, we hope!


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PostPosted: Mon January 29th, 2018, 18:28 GMT 
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notdarkyet wrote:
make that 6/40 = 15%, as you have not listed two of the very best releases by Dylan, Inc. since 1990

Bob Dylan ‎– Live 1961-2000 ~ Thirty-Nine Years Of Great Concert Performances
Released: 28 Feb 2001

Bob Dylan ‎– Pure Dylan: An Intimate Look At Bob Dylan
Released: 21 Oct 2011


...and the figures go crazier, you have mentioned
2016 Live in Sydney 1966
2016 The Real Royal Albert Hall 1966 Concert and
1998 BS 4 - Live 1966...but what about the other 30 discs from the 1966 Live Recordings that have been released?


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PostPosted: Mon January 29th, 2018, 19:21 GMT 
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He'll probably release three albums of originals... One produced by "Jack Frost", one by Don Was, and one by Jack White. They'll make the '60s trilogy look amateurish and even outshine the gospel trilogy (if one can fathom that). Whether or not they can compare to his output since Time Out of Mind remains to be heard.


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PostPosted: Mon January 29th, 2018, 20:09 GMT 
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For the record, NOTHING could ever make the 60s trilogy look "amateurish"; just like nothing will ever make BOTT sound trivial.
That said, if I was a religious person, I'd definitely be praying for a new album of originals by now... PLEASE, Bob!


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PostPosted: Mon January 29th, 2018, 22:32 GMT 

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Thanks for the list, much appreciated, even though I'm not quite sure if I entirely agree with your math.

Greatest Hits albums and Deluxe re-releases are an inevitable fact of life for any artists who's been around for a while and has das a decent amount of success. It's like cashing in a check - you do it without thinking about it. As far as we know, Dylan had zero involvement in them. As for the Anniversary box sets - they were strictly a legal thing. Not sure if they should count towards diminishing the percentage of releases with new original material.

I also fail to see how the "30th Anniversary Concert" would be considered a Dylan album, when in fact the "Wonder Boys" soundtrack had more songs sung by Dylan (one of them a new and at the time exclusive original!)

I count the releases a little differently. I'd include anything that was released on vinyl as well, 28 releases. That's some 22% for the original albums.

2017 BS13 - Trouble No More 1979-81
2017 Triplicate
2016 The Real Royal Albert Hall 1966 Concert
2016 Fallen Angels
2015 BS12 Cutting Edge 1965-66
2015 Shadows in the Night
2014 BS11 - Basement Tapes Complete
2013 BS10 - Another Self Portrait
2012 Tempest!
2011 In Concert Brandeis University 1963
2010 BS9 - Witmark Demos 1962-64
2009 Christmas in the Heart
2009 Together Through Life!
2008 BS8 - Tell Tale Signs
2006 Modern Times!
2005 BS7 - No Direction Home
2004 BS6 - Live 1964
2002 BS 5 - Rolling Thunder 1975
2001 Love and Theft
2000 Best of Vol. 2
1998 BS 4 - Live 1966
1997 Time Out of Mind!
1995 MTV Unplugged
1994 Greatest Hits 3
1993 World Gone Wrong
1992 Good As I Been To You
1991 BS 1-3 - Rare & Unreleased 1961-91
1990 Under the Red Sky![/quote]

Also (and I do realise I''m cheating now), the numbers change considerably, if you cut out the two long strectches void of originals and only look a 1997-2012:

16 years, 14 releases, 5 of them with originals: 36 % (hope that's correct, math is not my strongpoint)


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PostPosted: Tue January 30th, 2018, 01:25 GMT 
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notdarkyet wrote:
make that 6/40 = 15%, as you have not listed two of the very best releases by Dylan, Inc. since 1990

Bob Dylan ‎– Live 1961-2000 ~ Thirty-Nine Years Of Great Concert Performances
Released: 28 Feb 2001

Bob Dylan ‎– Pure Dylan: An Intimate Look At Bob Dylan
Released: 21 Oct 2011


Correct. Perhaps I will add them.

dvdunplugged wrote:
...and the figures go crazier, you have mentioned
2016 Live in Sydney 1966
2016 The Real Royal Albert Hall 1966 Concert and
1998 BS 4 - Live 1966...but what about the other 30 discs from the 1966 Live Recordings that have been released?

Correct.
Perhaps I will remove Sydney & Royal Hall, although I thought they could be purchased individually.


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PostPosted: Tue January 30th, 2018, 01:32 GMT 
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Handsomeinthefog wrote:
Thanks for the list, much appreciated, even though I'm not quite sure if I entirely agree with your math.

Greatest Hits albums and Deluxe re-releases are an inevitable fact of life for any artists who's been around for a while and has das a decent amount of success. It's like cashing in a check - you do it without thinking about it. As far as we know, Dylan had zero involvement in them. As for the Anniversary box sets - they were strictly a legal thing. Not sure if they should count towards diminishing the percentage of releases with new original material.

I also fail to see how the "30th Anniversary Concert" would be considered a Dylan album, when in fact the "Wonder Boys" soundtrack had more songs sung by Dylan (one of them a new and at the time exclusive original!)



The greatest hits, the ‘lives’ , the covers and the BS’s, etc., show that Dylan Inc. has lots of non-new-original releases too.
Only 6 new original releases in all that time and amongst all those releases.

Perhaps Wonder Boys should be added? Never really considered it.


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PostPosted: Tue January 30th, 2018, 08:34 GMT 
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Still Go Barefoot wrote:
dvdunplugged wrote:
...and the figures go crazier, you have mentioned
2016 Live in Sydney 1966
2016 The Real Royal Albert Hall 1966 Concert and
1998 BS 4 - Live 1966...but what about the other 30 discs from the 1966 Live Recordings that have been released?

Correct.
Perhaps I will remove Sydney & Royal Hall, although I thought they could be purchased individually.

Correct, they could be purchased individually but there were 30 discs from the box set that have only been available as part of the set. It's no big deal but it buggers up the percentages of original releases to live / compilations, etc.


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PostPosted: Tue January 30th, 2018, 09:26 GMT 
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and if we would only take a look at the quarter of a century from 1992 to 2017, and would stack all the CDs with recently recorded studio material, we would have 5 discs filled with original songs, and 8 discs filled with cover songs


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PostPosted: Tue January 30th, 2018, 12:58 GMT 

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Still Go Barefoot wrote:
The greatest hits, the ‘lives’ , the covers and the BS’s, etc., show that Dylan Inc. has lots of non-new-original releases too.
Only 6 new original releases in all that time and amongst all those releases.

Perhaps Wonder Boys should be added? Never really considered it.


But that's kind of the point. How many of these would Dylan, the artist have put out and how many of these were put out by Dylan, Inc (and Sony) because there's any easy payback?

I chose the vinyl distinction because - maybe in my mind only - pretty much everything has seems to have real artistic merit came out on vinyl while the cash-in compilation were usually CD only, with a couple of exceptions. "Best Of Vol. 2" did came out on vinyl (putting "Things Have Changed" into vinyl for the first time) and The Gaslight Tapes release for Starbucks did not.

I believe the Starbucks release was missing on your inital list, as was the Victoria's Secret CD, both with exclusive content.

It's all very subjective of course and nobody's ever really right or wrong.


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PostPosted: Tue January 30th, 2018, 17:08 GMT 
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Handsomeinthefog wrote:
But that's kind of the point. How many of these would Dylan, the artist have put out and how many of these were put out by Dylan, Inc (and Sony) because there's any easy payback?
...
It's all very subjective of course and nobody's ever really right or wrong.

There is no right or wrong. It’s not meant to be an argumentative thread.
Let’s go back the ORIGINAL statement & question:

Still Go Barefoot wrote:
We are due for another original Bob Dylan album!
Do you agree?

And then let’s just strip the supporting info down to this:
- only 6 albums of original songs released, since 1990

2012 Tempest!
2009 Together Through Life!
2006 Modern Times!
2001 Love and Theft!
1997 Time Out of Mind!
1990 Under the Red Sky!

Seems like we are due for another album of originals.
Do you agree?


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PostPosted: Tue January 30th, 2018, 18:12 GMT 
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Quote:
Do you agree?


YES!


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PostPosted: Tue January 30th, 2018, 20:40 GMT 

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I've tried listening to his albums as if they came out in reverse order. That is, as if he started out in 1961 singing Sinatra covers, a young man trying to sound old; started to find his own voice in the mid-sixties with Tempest; established himself as the voice of generation with "Love and Theft", and then topped that with Time Out of Mind. Etc., etc., but ending with the starkly titled [/I]Bob Dylan[/I], another album of covers, an old man sounding young again as he dug deep into the roots of American music.


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PostPosted: Tue January 30th, 2018, 21:20 GMT 
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mojofilter wrote:
I've tried listening to his albums as if they came out in reverse order. That is, as if he started out in 1961 singing Sinatra covers, a young man trying to sound old; started to find his own voice in the mid-sixties with Tempest; established himself as the voice of generation with "Love and Theft", and then topped that with Time Out of Mind. Etc., etc., but ending with the starkly titled [/I]Bob Dylan[/I], another album of covers, an old man sounding young again as he dug deep into the roots of American music.


Post of the week.

Interesting concept that I am tempted to experience for myself.


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PostPosted: Wed January 31st, 2018, 00:57 GMT 
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mojofilter wrote:
I've tried listening to his albums as if they came out in reverse order. That is, as if he started out in 1961 singing Sinatra covers, a young man trying to sound old; started to find his own voice in the mid-sixties with Tempest; established himself as the voice of generation with "Love and Theft", and then topped that with Time Out of Mind. Etc., etc., but ending with the starkly titled [/I]Bob Dylan[/I], another album of covers, an old man sounding young again as he dug deep into the roots of American music.

Reverse order... If that were the case, I would hope for an early retirement... Blood On the Tracks would seem appropriate enough. Just before it becomes intolerable.


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PostPosted: Wed January 31st, 2018, 01:03 GMT 

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Untrodden Path wrote:
mojofilter wrote:
I've tried listening to his albums as if they came out in reverse order. That is, as if he started out in 1961 singing Sinatra covers, a young man trying to sound old; started to find his own voice in the mid-sixties with Tempest; established himself as the voice of generation with "Love and Theft", and then topped that with Time Out of Mind. Etc., etc., but ending with the starkly titled [/I]Bob Dylan[/I], another album of covers, an old man sounding young again as he dug deep into the roots of American music.

Reverse order... If that were the case, I would hope for an early retirement... Blood On the Tracks would seem appropriate enough. Just before it becomes intolerable.


So, just to set the record straight in my mind, anything prior to Blood for you isn't good? Or do you like later renditions of those 60s songs? I'm not throwing stones, I happen to think BOTT is his best work, and that since the 90s he's been putting out some of his best stuff, but I can't say I hate the sixties stuff. As they are, they still are towering achievements for the most part, I just prefer mid and late career Dylan. But I've always been curious as to what you think of those records.


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PostPosted: Wed January 31st, 2018, 10:11 GMT 

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Still Go Barefoot wrote:
We are due for another original Bob Dylan album!
Do you agree?

And then let’s just strip the supporting info down to this:
- only 6 albums of original songs released, since 1990

2012 Tempest!
2009 Together Through Life!
2006 Modern Times!
2001 Love and Theft!
1997 Time Out of Mind!
1990 Under the Red Sky!

Seems like we are due for another album of originals.
Do you agree?
[/quote]

Time-wise? Possibly! But art isn't a nine to five job, obviously.

Personally, I don't think there will be another Dylan album of original unless something significant happens, something he just had to write about. Kind of like Leonard Cohen suddenly returned to writing and releasing albums.

Here's why I think that:

- He kinda hasn't done anything 100% original in a couple of decades now and has received more and more criticism for borrowing bits and pieces.
- The Nobel price has put extra weight on his shoulders. Even for Dylan, it would be pretty much impossible to live up to that, in a Harper Lee kind of way.
- Yes, he did record covers in the 90s and eventually returned to originals, but: the folk albums of the 90s were Dylan taking a step to the side and eventually returning to the path he had begun with "Oh Mercy" when he did "TOOM". This time around the covers albums are pretty much the logical consequence of moving towards that sound with his original work in the 2000s and borrowing tunes and lyrics elsewhere. There's no previous path he could return to.
- What he'd need is almost a u-turn, a new approach, definitely new band/collaborators. But: Dylan is 76 years old and after 40 years of being unpredictable, he's now kept the basic name band for 12+ years and has reduced his vast back catalog to about 15 songs for live performances. I see nothing that would point towards the kind of change needed for him to make even a half exciting new album of originals. I can see him make a watered-down "Together Through Life", but I'm not sure if he wanted to do that *and* put that out.


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PostPosted: Wed January 31st, 2018, 13:10 GMT 
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ShotofMercy wrote:
Untrodden Path wrote:
Reverse order... If that were the case, I would hope for an early retirement... Blood On the Tracks would seem appropriate enough. Just before it becomes intolerable.


So, just to set the record straight in my mind, anything prior to Blood for you isn't good? Or do you like later renditions of those 60s songs? I'm not throwing stones, I happen to think BOTT is his best work, and that since the 90s he's been putting out some of his best stuff, but I can't say I hate the sixties stuff. As they are, they still are towering achievements for the most part, I just prefer mid and late career Dylan. But I've always been curious as to what you think of those records.

For me, the NET performances of the '60s material is incredible... the way it was officially released in the '60s unnecessary and forgettable if not regrettable.

Quite frankly, from Before the Flood to the present, the live performances of the '60s material (as well as everything else) has been consistently very good to excellent. Again, this is my opinion and it isn't shared by many but there isn't a single nanosecond from his '60s officially released or live performances that I care to ever suffer through again. Life is too short. For those who love it and support it, that is good. Its that kind of diversity in tastes and interests that keep life interesting.


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PostPosted: Wed January 31st, 2018, 23:15 GMT 
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mojofilter wrote:
I've tried listening to his albums as if they came out in reverse order. That is, as if he started out in 1961 singing Sinatra covers, a young man trying to sound old; started to find his own voice in the mid-sixties with Tempest; established himself as the voice of generation with "Love and Theft", and then topped that with Time Out of Mind. Etc., etc., but ending with the starkly titled [/I]Bob Dylan[/I], another album of covers, an old man sounding young again as he dug deep into the roots of American music.
Fascinating! I like that.

Sent from my SM-J327P using Tapatalk


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PostPosted: Thu February 1st, 2018, 02:14 GMT 
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Handsomeinthefog wrote:
Personally, I don't think there will be another Dylan album of originals

I do.
And here's why I think that:

Handsomeinthefog wrote:
- He kinda hasn't done anything 100% original in a couple of decades now and has received more and more criticism for borrowing bits and pieces.
- The Nobel price has put extra weight on his shoulders. Even for Dylan, it would be pretty much impossible to live up to that, in a Harper Lee kind of way.
- Yes, he did record covers in the 90s and eventually returned to originals, but: the folk albums of the 90s were Dylan taking a step to the side and eventually returning to the path he had begun with "Oh Mercy" when he did "TOOM". This time around the covers albums are pretty much the logical consequence of moving towards that sound with his original work in the 2000s and borrowing tunes and lyrics elsewhere. There's no previous path he could return to.
- What he'd need is almost a u-turn, a new approach, definitely new band/collaborators. But: Dylan is 76 years old and after 40 years of being unpredictable, he's now kept the basic name band for 12+ years and has reduced his vast back catalog to about 15 songs for live performances. I see nothing that would point towards the kind of change needed for him to make even a half exciting new album of originals. I can see him make a watered-down "Together Through Life", but I'm not sure if he wanted to do that *and* put that out.


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PostPosted: Thu February 1st, 2018, 02:35 GMT 

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It seems that Dylan sees touring as his main occupation/passion lately, but one would hope that he still has moments of inspiration and is still writing songs. Maybe not the flood of past years, but there must still be at least a trickle?

I have tried listening to the the last 5 Sinatra releases again the last few days. They could have made one really good album (maybe double at a push) but 5 is just way too much of the same sounding material. Plus these songs are nowhere near as good as songs Bob himself has written. Bob might have a great respect for them and they might be "the American songbook" but none of the songs even compare to Dylan at his best (whatever you think that is). I'd rather he did blues/folk/country covers than these songs.

Never mind, at least I got to hear the theme from "Birds of a Feather" sung by Bob live.


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