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PostPosted: Thu August 24th, 2017, 15:02 GMT 
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dvdunplugged wrote:
He's made his share of duffo albums

...and the one's I'm thinking of aren't worth wasting any more time and money on!


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PostPosted: Thu August 24th, 2017, 15:10 GMT 

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I agree that the main tragedy is those 1980s albums ruined or heavily wounded by clinically insane exclusions. Had he left major songs like 'Blind Willie McTell,' 'Angelina,' 'Foot of Pride,' 'Caribbean Wind,' etc., on those records, he could have avoided the worst of the 'Bob Dylan is a burned-out 1960s relic' narrative that defined him for so many years. Nobody would have claimed he was still the equal of his 1960s peak self, but it would have been much harder to portray him as a pathetic, drug-fuddled, spent force.

The secondary tragedy is what happened to UTRS. Searching uncertainly for the "roots Americana" sound that would eventually define his later career, Bob needed a sympathetic producer who could hear what he was groping for. Instead he got a clown who wanted him to be a Rawk Star. I maintain to this day that if those songs had been treated like mysterious artifacts from the Harry Smith anthology - given a mandolin, a fiddle, banjos, that sort of extreme folk treatment - we'd have a mostly fascinating album on our hands. I still kinda wish some enterprising roots act would re-record that album.

Oh well.


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PostPosted: Thu August 24th, 2017, 16:07 GMT 
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Bromberg '92. Good As I Been To You should have been culled from those sessions.

I mean - fuck:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFRYQStXCWw


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PostPosted: Thu August 24th, 2017, 17:14 GMT 
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The fact that he made Slow Train Coming, and Saved, starting preaching at his audience that they're going to hell and all that kinda crap, and basically killed the Bob Dylan that existed before replacing him with a lesser version of himself


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PostPosted: Thu August 24th, 2017, 17:40 GMT 

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To me the biggest tragedy was that he never did studio recordings any of the post Blonde on Blonde / pre Basement Tapes songs like "On A Rainy Afternoon" and "I Can't Leave Her Behind."


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PostPosted: Thu August 24th, 2017, 18:44 GMT 
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rolling_thunder wrote:
The fact that he made Slow Train Coming, and Saved, starting preaching at his audience that they're going to hell and all that kinda crap, and basically killed the Bob Dylan that existed before replacing him with a lesser version of himself


There are great, great songs on those albums. Some of his very finest, in my opinion. As said earlier, this thread is a bit silly giving how much great material Bob has given us, but if I had to choose...it would be spending the last few years on covering standards instead of writing new material. Tempest is a masterpiece and I wish he would have just taken that time to write new songs.


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PostPosted: Thu August 24th, 2017, 19:17 GMT 
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Cold Irons Bound wrote:
rolling_thunder wrote:
The fact that he made Slow Train Coming, and Saved, starting preaching at his audience that they're going to hell and all that kinda crap, and basically killed the Bob Dylan that existed before replacing him with a lesser version of himself


There are great, great songs on those albums. Some of his very finest, in my opinion. As said earlier, this thread is a bit silly giving how much great material Bob has given us, but if I had to choose...it would be spending the last few years on covering standards instead of writing new material. Tempest is a masterpiece and I wish he would have just taken that time to write new songs.


There are good songs on those albums, but they're not good enough to overlook the fact that he changed in such a way that the person he was before that everyone admired, and looked up to so much ceased to exist with these albums. Perhaps that was by design, but nevertheless...he lost something around this time that he'd never fully get back. As he later said "You can come back, but you can't come back all the way"...he himself is proof of this, and he may have been talking about himself when he sang that line.


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PostPosted: Thu August 24th, 2017, 19:27 GMT 
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@rolling_thunder: I think that might have happened anyone as a byproduct of being a rock and roll start turning 40.

@Lone Pilgrim: I agree with you. But rather than changing Infidels and Empire (although I agree this album could be re-discovered minus the 80'sSynth) - I think that all those leftovers should have been poured into KOL and DitG.

Clearly there were two albums of filler on the plate. But instead of the weird shit he released, save Brownsville, and Silvio and then dump everything that ended up on BS3 into those two albums and the 80's would have been a consistently stellar decade.


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PostPosted: Thu August 24th, 2017, 19:41 GMT 
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dvdunplugged wrote:
I think my biggest disappointment with Bob's recording career is that despite remixes and remastering and whatever else they've done with Street Legal we still don't have a recording that shows off the songs to their full potential. He's made his share of duffo albums, I'd be the first to agree but Street Legal could have been a whole lot better if the production was better in the first place.


With respect, i couldn't agree with you there, the 2003 SACD reissue of Street Legal
sounds excellent. The percussion is crisp, and it sounds sharper and nowhere near
as murky as the original version. Compare the 2003 reissue with the sound of say,
Shot Of Love, and the SACD version of Street Legal sonically soars way above it.
Be nice to have an SACD version of Shot Of Love.


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PostPosted: Thu August 24th, 2017, 20:04 GMT 

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McG wrote:
Bromberg '92. Good As I Been To You should have been culled from those sessions.

I mean - fuck:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFRYQStXCWw


could have been great - if only his voice didn't sound like Mickey Mouse suffering from a servere cold…


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PostPosted: Thu August 24th, 2017, 20:20 GMT 
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rolling_thunder wrote:
There are good songs on those albums, but they're not good enough to overlook the fact that he changed in such a way that the person he was before that everyone admired, and looked up to so much ceased to exist with these albums. Perhaps that was by design, but nevertheless...he lost something around this time that he'd never fully get back.


I agree, but that was bound to happen, a person's career doesn't just continue ascending. Some would say "the person admired and looked up to" went away when he went electric. Others with Self Portrait. Others with Street-Legal. I guess it comes down to how much the religious content bothers you. I listened to it long after it happened and was raised in a religious environment so to me it just seems like one more unexpected turn in a career full of them.


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PostPosted: Thu August 24th, 2017, 20:24 GMT 
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Cold Irons Bound wrote:
rolling_thunder wrote:
There are good songs on those albums, but they're not good enough to overlook the fact that he changed in such a way that the person he was before that everyone admired, and looked up to so much ceased to exist with these albums. Perhaps that was by design, but nevertheless...he lost something around this time that he'd never fully get back.


I agree, but that was bound to happen, a person's career doesn't just continue ascending. Some would say "the person admired and looked up to" went away when he went electric. Others with Self Portrait. Others with Street-Legal. I guess it comes down to how much the religious content bothers you. I listened to it long after it happened and was raised in a religious environment so to me it just seems like one more unexpected turn in a career full of them.


The Religious content bothers me greatly, and it means that he was a different person philosophically from that point onward from the man he was in his youth.


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PostPosted: Thu August 24th, 2017, 22:00 GMT 
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rolling_thunder wrote:
Cold Irons Bound wrote:

I agree, but that was bound to happen, a person's career doesn't just continue ascending. Some would say "the person admired and looked up to" went away when he went electric. Others with Self Portrait. Others with Street-Legal. I guess it comes down to how much the religious content bothers you. I listened to it long after it happened and was raised in a religious environment so to me it just seems like one more unexpected turn in a career full of them.


The Religious content bothers me greatly, and it means that he was a different person philosophically from that point onward from the man he was in his youth.


I think it can be safely said that if Dylan knew this bothers you so much (and that's extremely unlikely) he'd probably advise you not to listen to it-problem solved.


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PostPosted: Thu August 24th, 2017, 22:19 GMT 

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goin electric!!! BASTARD. :P


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PostPosted: Fri August 25th, 2017, 01:16 GMT 
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The word "tragedy" in the title seems a little over the top, since the thread reads more like:
"and here's my own personal disappointment with Dylan doing what he wants to."

Anyhow, no tragedies witnessed here either.
Perhaps just the embarrassment of the Standards kick...
...otherwise, love the way history has unfolded, so far.


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PostPosted: Fri August 25th, 2017, 01:24 GMT 
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1990 was a tragedy. Poor album, poor touring. Bob was dressed in gallons of wool, sweating out pounds of booze, all while staring at his shoes for 90 minutes.


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PostPosted: Fri August 25th, 2017, 01:51 GMT 
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dylanswife wrote:
1990 was a tragedy. Poor album, poor touring. Bob was dressed in gallons of wool, sweating out pounds of booze, all while staring at his shoes for 90 minutes.

What?
The album was weak, yes, especially at the time.
But G.E. Smith was a strong concert sidekick, making for some tremendous shows in those days.

Check out this vid of the 5 June 1990 Toronto show, right in the middle of the year:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=faxAEQaMZnM

SETLIST
Subterranean Homesick Blues
I'll Remember You
Stuck Inside of Mobile With the Memphis Blues Again
Tears of Rage
Masters of War
Gotta Serve Somebody
Tomorrow Is a Long Time
Desolation Row
The Lonesome Death of Hattie Carroll
John Brown
One Too Many Mornings
Everything Is Broken
Simple Twist of Fate
All Along the Watchtower
I Shall Be Released
Like a Rolling Stone
Barbara Allen
The Times They Are A-Changin'
Highway 61 Revisited


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PostPosted: Fri August 25th, 2017, 02:06 GMT 
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Many of the acoustic sets with GE and the solo numbers are great. I find that 1990-1992 were the last year's Desolation Row was enjoyable.

I don't know how he pulled it off though, Bob looked to be a complete mess at the time and his singing voice was at an all time low. I rank 1990 as the worst touring year of Bobs career, however, there are a number of gems.


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PostPosted: Fri August 25th, 2017, 09:43 GMT 
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seg wrote:
goin electric!!! BASTARD. :P

:lol:


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PostPosted: Sat August 26th, 2017, 13:37 GMT 
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that x christmas album and the last three granddad albums
truly tragic


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PostPosted: Sat August 26th, 2017, 19:10 GMT 
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dylanswife wrote:
Many of the acoustic sets with GE and the solo numbers are great. I find that 1990-1992 were the last year's Desolation Row was enjoyable.

I don't know how he pulled it off though, Bob looked to be a complete mess at the time and his singing voice was at an all time low. I rank 1990 as the worst touring year of Bobs career, however, there are a number of gems.



It's hard to explain to people just how disappointed many people were in Dylan shows at this time. After all, just 4 years earlier he had been sounding "more or less" like himself with Tom Petty, and the live Hard to Handle vhs was a pretty fresh release. In the pre-internet era people were absolutely shocked by his degraded voice and bizarre presentation. In the rear view mirror there were some damn fine shows, though.


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PostPosted: Sat August 26th, 2017, 19:27 GMT 
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smoke wrote:
dylanswife wrote:
Many of the acoustic sets with GE and the solo numbers are great. I find that 1990-1992 were the last year's Desolation Row was enjoyable.

I don't know how he pulled it off though, Bob looked to be a complete mess at the time and his singing voice was at an all time low. I rank 1990 as the worst touring year of Bobs career, however, there are a number of gems.



It's hard to explain to people just how disappointed many people were in Dylan shows at this time. After all, just 4 years earlier he had been sounding "more or less" like himself with Tom Petty, and the live Hard to Handle vhs was a pretty fresh release. In the pre-internet era people were absolutely shocked by his degraded voice and bizarre presentation. In the rear view mirror there were some damn fine shows, though.


This is all true. By 1990, Bob wasn't even a remote imitation of himself. Mid to late 80s Bob seemed like Bob imitating himself more or less. The lifetime achievement MoW performance literally destroyed his reputation. Comedians, talk show hosts, SnL, and media outlets all attacked Bob for sounding like a vacuum cleaner. And this is what people still remember today who are regular fans or appreciate the mans music.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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PostPosted: Sat August 26th, 2017, 19:34 GMT 
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:(
The long gap between Tempest and ????????????.


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PostPosted: Sat August 26th, 2017, 19:34 GMT 
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After that grammy show, a blurb in the Chicago Tribune said "he should retire and stop embarrassing himself and his entire generation". I think of that sometimes when people are down on him now. Imagine what we'd be deprived of if he'd taken that guy's advice.


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PostPosted: Sat August 26th, 2017, 19:45 GMT 
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Some friends at work at the time talked about that particular MoW performance the next day. Sharon, who was the head of finance, said It must have been that motorcycle accident where he suffered brain damage and was in total shock that "they" let Bob perform. I was impressed she knew of the alleged accident, but I too was shocked by the performance. But brain damage? No I doubt that, since it likely never happened.


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