Expecting Rain

Go to main page
It is currently Tue June 27th, 2017, 22:34 GMT

All times are UTC




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 28 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Wed April 5th, 2017, 06:25 GMT 
User avatar

Joined: Wed April 5th, 2017, 06:07 GMT
Posts: 6
I've been thinking a lot about New Pony recently, which is in my opinion not only one of the best songs on Street-Legal but one of his best blues in general. The images are strong and surprisingly wordy throughout, but one verse in particular sticks out to me:

Sometimes I wonder what's going on with Miss X
Sometimes I wonder what's going on with Miss X
She got such a sweet disposition
I never know what the poor girl's gonna do to me next

Some meaning can be derived out of the song otherwise, the old and new ponies most obviously being symbols for God and the devil, with him possibly shunning a godless practitioner of voodoo in another verse. But the verse about Miss X doesn't fit so clearly for me. Has anybody given this any thought?

And since when Bob writes nonsense we like to say it's more about the feeling of the words than their meaning, how does it make you feel? What does it make you think of?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Wed April 5th, 2017, 06:33 GMT 
User avatar

Joined: Thu September 17th, 2015, 01:28 GMT
Posts: 522
Have never been a big fan of New Pony, usually skip over, perhaps I should give another listen sometime.

In regards to those lines, I've always taken it as the narrator thinking about a woman who perhaps is unpredictable in her ways and feelings to him, thus wounding him ("never know what she'll do to me next" ie. drive me insane etc.)

Miss X could also be a hint at ex as in ex-lover. Perhaps he even had "Sometimes I think of my ex" before realising that cut too close to the bone with his recent divorce and all.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Wed April 5th, 2017, 06:47 GMT 
User avatar

Joined: Mon March 30th, 2009, 14:57 GMT
Posts: 1259
Location: Madly Across the Sun
Who knew there was an extra unsung verse to New Pony?

https://bobdylan.com/songs/new-pony/

Well now, it was early in the mornin’, I seen your shadow in the door
It was early in the mornin’, I seen your shadow in the door
Now, I don’t have to ask nobody
I know what you come here for


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Wed April 5th, 2017, 10:31 GMT 
Promethium Member
User avatar

Joined: Fri July 15th, 2011, 02:23 GMT
Posts: 20553
Nellie posted a good New Pony roundup entry about halfway down page 1, about this song (& extra verse) over here:

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=72564&hilit=New+Pony


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Wed April 5th, 2017, 11:17 GMT 
Titanium Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat January 3rd, 2009, 15:19 GMT
Posts: 8043
Location: Desolation Row
I love New Pony. Check out the Dead Weather's epic cover.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Wed April 5th, 2017, 11:52 GMT 
Promethium Member
User avatar

Joined: Fri July 15th, 2011, 02:23 GMT
Posts: 20553
gibsona07 wrote:
I love New Pony. Check out the Dead Weather's epic cover.

Ya, I'm not much on Dylan covers, in general, but that one explodes!
If you like that, you might also like Rage Against the Machine's "Maggie's Farm".


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Wed April 5th, 2017, 12:05 GMT 
Titanium Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed May 13th, 2009, 01:17 GMT
Posts: 6924
I love 'New Pony'. I don't know what it's really about - and don't much care: it's a storming, gospel-infused, hard blues where everyone from Bob to the engineer with his oil-can is cooking. Not much more to say :)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Wed April 5th, 2017, 13:46 GMT 

Joined: Sat August 25th, 2007, 21:54 GMT
Posts: 1598
Great mixture of spiritual and carnal, as carnal as Dylan ever got. Plus it's got that epiphany where he sings "gonna give ya back what you been wishin' on someone else" - one of the finest Dylan record moments ever to my ears. I think the singer is poking some fun at himself, at his ex-wife, and at his new girl friend all at the same time. How Dylan fans miss this tune puzzles me. It's light years better than Senor.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Wed April 5th, 2017, 14:50 GMT 

Joined: Tue February 3rd, 2015, 19:05 GMT
Posts: 423
Love this song and the whole album


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Wed April 5th, 2017, 17:45 GMT 

Joined: Tue June 21st, 2016, 17:01 GMT
Posts: 146
yopietro wrote:
Who knew there was an extra unsung verse to New Pony?

https://bobdylan.com/songs/new-pony/

Well now, it was early in the mornin’, I seen your shadow in the door
It was early in the mornin’, I seen your shadow in the door
Now, I don’t have to ask nobody
I know what you come here for


"Whatcha Gonna Do":

Tell me what you're gonna do
When the shadow comes under your door.
Tell me what you're gonna do
When the shadow comes under your door.
Tell me what you're gonna do
When the shadow comes under your door.
O Lord, O Lord,
What shall you do?

Now what do you suppose was going through his mind when he repurposed this verse (from an old spiritual) for "New Pony"? In "Whatcha Gonna Do," the shadow is death. In "New Pony," it's sex, temptation, the voodoo-using woman. That's a pretty potent psychic mixture, and maybe a good clue to where his head was at in 1977.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Wed April 5th, 2017, 19:44 GMT 

Joined: Mon September 6th, 2010, 04:11 GMT
Posts: 9
Bob made it clear in his 78 rolling stone interview that this was about "Miss X" and not "Miss Ex". Which means it was probably about "Miss Ex"...


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Thu April 6th, 2017, 11:06 GMT 
User avatar

Joined: Mon August 8th, 2011, 09:39 GMT
Posts: 1649
Location: Between Lincoln County Road and Armageddon
t_oom wrote:
I've been thinking a lot about New Pony recently, which is in my opinion not only one of the best songs on Street-Legal but one of his best blues in general. The images are strong and surprisingly wordy throughout, but one verse in particular sticks out to me:

Sometimes I wonder what's going on with Miss X
Sometimes I wonder what's going on with Miss X
She got such a sweet disposition
I never know what the poor girl's gonna do to me next

Some meaning can be derived out of the song otherwise, the old and new ponies most obviously being symbols for God and the devil, with him possibly shunning a godless practitioner of voodoo in another verse. But the verse about Miss X doesn't fit so clearly for me. Has anybody given this any thought?

And since when Bob writes nonsense we like to say it's more about the feeling of the words than their meaning, how does it make you feel? What does it make you think of?


I never thought that then old and the new pony could symbolize God and Devil, even the name of the old pony is given as Lucifer.. For me, this always meant his old woman (Miss Ex, indeed) and a new girlfriend (with great, big hind legs, whatever that is supposed to mean).


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Thu April 6th, 2017, 11:11 GMT 
Titanium Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat January 3rd, 2009, 15:19 GMT
Posts: 8043
Location: Desolation Row
In that period, God is often portrayed as a female sexual conquest in Dylan songs. Which is odd. Oh Sister, New Pony, Precious Angel. There are probably more.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Thu April 6th, 2017, 15:35 GMT 
User avatar

Joined: Wed December 5th, 2012, 18:52 GMT
Posts: 4565
Location: In a hole in the ground there lived a....
gibsona07 wrote:
In that period, God is often portrayed as a female sexual conquest in Dylan songs. Which is odd. Oh Sister, New Pony, Precious Angel. There are probably more.


I always found and still find the line about when God and her were born to be confusing.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Thu April 6th, 2017, 18:49 GMT 

Joined: Fri January 5th, 2007, 23:38 GMT
Posts: 1655
Location: Ireland
kuddukan wrote:
gibsona07 wrote:
In that period, God is often portrayed as a female sexual conquest in Dylan songs. Which is odd. Oh Sister, New Pony, Precious Angel. There are probably more.


I always found and still find the line about when God and her were born to be confusing.


Could he be referring to the Incarnation, accompanied by the consequent birth of the Church (the Bride of Christ)? I have a memory of reading an article that asserted Shelter From The Storm was about the Catholic Church. It certainly seems plausible that it is about the Christian Church in the broader sense and it didn't take very long before he decided to 'cross the line'. As for Dylan's wish to 'turn back the clock to when God and her were born', didn't Dylan express an aspiration in that Biograph interview to have lived at the time of the apostles?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Fri April 7th, 2017, 06:01 GMT 
User avatar

Joined: Mon October 18th, 2010, 03:16 GMT
Posts: 976
t_oom wrote:
I've been thinking a lot about New Pony recently, which is in my opinion not only one of the best songs on Street-Legal but one of his best blues in general. The images are strong and surprisingly wordy throughout, but one verse in particular sticks out to me:

Sometimes I wonder what's going on with Miss X
Sometimes I wonder what's going on with Miss X
She got such a sweet disposition
I never know what the poor girl's gonna do to me next

Some meaning can be derived out of the song otherwise, the old and new ponies most obviously being symbols for God and the devil, with him possibly shunning a godless practitioner of voodoo in another verse. But the verse about Miss X doesn't fit so clearly for me. Has anybody given this any thought?

And since when Bob writes nonsense we like to say it's more about the feeling of the words than their meaning, how does it make you feel? What does it make you think of?


Do yourself a favour and listen to Will Oldham's (Bonnie 'Prince' Billy's) live cover from 1994.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Fri April 7th, 2017, 06:42 GMT 
User avatar

Joined: Wed April 5th, 2017, 06:07 GMT
Posts: 6
Mickvet wrote:
kuddukan wrote:

I always found and still find the line about when God and her were born to be confusing.


Could he be referring to the Incarnation, accompanied by the consequent birth of the Church (the Bride of Christ)? I have a memory of reading an article that asserted Shelter From The Storm was about the Catholic Church. It certainly seems plausible that it is about the Christian Church in the broader sense and it didn't take very long before he decided to 'cross the line'. As for Dylan's wish to 'turn back the clock to when God and her were born', didn't Dylan express an aspiration in that Biograph interview to have lived at the time of the apostles?


I've always figured "when God and her were born" served simply to equate her with God. She's already been given such a godlike treatment throughout the song:

In a world of steel-eyed death, and men who are fighting to be warm
Come in, she said
I'll give ya shelter from the storm

She's hardly ever referred to in human terms, always a goddess appearing and embracing the narrator. I think it's nothing more than a romantic notion that she's a force of good as old as time.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Fri April 7th, 2017, 13:20 GMT 

Joined: Sat August 25th, 2007, 21:54 GMT
Posts: 1598
gibsona07 wrote:
In that period, God is often portrayed as a female sexual conquest in Dylan songs. Which is odd. Oh Sister, New Pony, Precious Angel. There are probably more.


I can't imagine New Pony has much to do with God. The new girlfriend's belief in God perhaps. A lust song all the way, with plenty of clues.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Fri April 7th, 2017, 13:41 GMT 
Promethium Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat October 27th, 2007, 12:44 GMT
Posts: 16384
Location: Workin' as a postal clerk
I don't think God is the woman in any of those songs. If God is the sister in Oh, Sister then who is the Father who doesn't like the way she acts? In Precious Angel she shows him the light but I've never gotten the sense she's actually God, or even a literal angel.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Fri April 7th, 2017, 15:08 GMT 
User avatar

Joined: Mon March 30th, 2009, 14:57 GMT
Posts: 1259
Location: Madly Across the Sun
monklover wrote:
gibsona07 wrote:
In that period, God is often portrayed as a female sexual conquest in Dylan songs. Which is odd. Oh Sister, New Pony, Precious Angel. There are probably more.


I can't imagine New Pony has much to do with God. The new girlfriend's belief in God perhaps. A lust song all the way, with plenty of clues.


New Pony is in the vein of those old blues tropes about the wicked, seductive, irresistible woman that often ends up "needing shooting" for causing the singer such pain. It is indeed a lust song.

The "precious angel" in Precious Angel to my ears sounds like a flesh and blood woman. A God-fearing woman who seems to have helped born-again Bob to have seen the light by shining hers on him.

As far as Oh Sister, it's one of the greatest and most outlandish pickup lines ever used to get laid. "Hey, if you don't let me in and sleep with me, God will be disappointed. In fact, if you don't take me to bed, you should be a little worried about it too. God will be angry! ("You must realize the danger"). The stones on that guy...


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Fri April 7th, 2017, 15:59 GMT 

Joined: Sat August 25th, 2007, 21:54 GMT
Posts: 1598
yopietro wrote:

As far as Oh Sister, it's one of the greatest and most outlandish pickup lines ever used to get laid. "Hey, if you don't let me in and sleep with me, God will be disappointed. In fact, if you don't take me to bed, you should be a little worried about it too. God will be angry! ("You must realize the danger"). The stones on that guy...


No kidding. Hi Darling, don't play hard to get, this could be your last chance to give me a hummer.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Fri April 7th, 2017, 17:51 GMT 

Joined: Tue January 6th, 2015, 15:03 GMT
Posts: 94
blindjesse wrote:
Bob made it clear in his 78 rolling stone interview that this was about "Miss X" and not "Miss Ex". Which means it was probably about "Miss Ex"...

Mondegreen time...

I initially thought he was singing "Sometimes I wonder what's going on with me sex..."



Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Fri April 7th, 2017, 18:18 GMT 

Joined: Fri January 5th, 2007, 23:38 GMT
Posts: 1655
Location: Ireland
mjmooney wrote:
blindjesse wrote:
Bob made it clear in his 78 rolling stone interview that this was about "Miss X" and not "Miss Ex". Which means it was probably about "Miss Ex"...

Mondegreen time...

I initially thought he was singing "Sometimes I wonder what's going on with me sex..."



That's nothin'! I first thought it was "...what's going on with me, sax". I claim Steve Douglas as my excuse.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Sat April 8th, 2017, 02:24 GMT 
User avatar

Joined: Sat December 10th, 2011, 15:23 GMT
Posts: 67
The cut on Street Legal is ruined by the "How much longer" girls. Maybe one day they're release an alternate version, or the same version with the backup singers muted. It's very annoying.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Pony discussion
PostPosted: Sat April 8th, 2017, 08:17 GMT 
User avatar

Joined: Sat September 10th, 2016, 12:46 GMT
Posts: 1249
Winter Lude wrote:
The cut on Street Legal is ruined by the "How much longer" girls. Maybe one day they're release an alternate version, or the same version with the backup singers muted. It's very annoying.


Nah, the song is perfect as it is, the girls give it that seedy edge it needs.

And great timing to discuss this song now, given his new album is a load of it old pony.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 28 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], mitja, twistedpin


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group