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PostPosted: Tue July 28th, 2015, 15:54 GMT 
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The last time I went to a Dylan concert I walked out thinking..... Wow, that is one hell of a band... that was some great music.... what a great show.... I think many players that work with major stars end up way more into a certain groove, night after night.... That is unless Jerry G. is back.... I saw one very, very great guitar player, one on the charts, while still in Austin.... a second time seeing him, had seen him a couple years before in Ohio..... At one point he hit his part with a long drawn part where the main player took over and everyone just waited.... there was a very long note he was singing (almost scream like).... I saw the bass player pick up his water bottle, unscrew it, take a big long drink, put the cap back on and put it back and then get his hands back in place to play..... the bass player knew exactly how long he was going to have to get that drink of water..... so if you had a choice of the same exact thing night after night, or sticking to the boss like glue for your next cue which would you pick.

Let's face it, Dylan can't win for losing..... either we sit out here in cyber land and complain that the set list doesn't change, or a good many people are walking out of the show saying.... 'that didn't sound like the record, what were those songs?" :lol:

To me the bottom line is Duke should have done his homework and he would have known the lead player does not get the spotlight in Dylan's band.... there is only one showboat on that stage and his name is on the sign out front.

I guess if he would start listening to other people about how he should direct his band (or sing a song) then he might have managed to have a long, successful, world-wide admired, quoted in the most surprising places, music career.... :wink:


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PostPosted: Tue July 28th, 2015, 16:36 GMT 

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Lily Rose wrote:

To me the bottom line is Duke should have done his homework and he would have known the lead player does not get the spotlight in Dylan's band.... there is only one showboat on that stage and his name is on the sign out front.



Okay, but is there any evidence/indication at all that this has anything to do with why Duke quit?

In others words, had Bob Dylan said to Duke "I'm searching for a more mimimalistic sound, so can you tone it down a bit please?", do you really think Duke would have deliberately ignored him, or quit mid-tour because of it? Of course not, the implication is absurd.

Where is all this "showboating" anyway; still talking about that one version of Thunder from the first show? Still not sure how that is relevant, seeing as he left the band nearly 3 months later.


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PostPosted: Tue July 28th, 2015, 16:45 GMT 
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Unless you can time travel and have the ability to hide in the corner with no one noticing you are not going to get any of the players telling the details, and then everyone can only tell you the story from THEIR point of view..... but.... Duke has put out a song called 'Svengali' (a way of saying someone who controls)..... and dedicated it to Bob..... does seem like someone thinks Bob is too controlling....... yep, back to the horse is dead, stop kicking it.... let it fade away... :roll:

For some reason it seems like this is a good place to say Denny Freeman is a class act 8)


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PostPosted: Tue July 28th, 2015, 16:53 GMT 
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Lily Rose wrote:

To me the bottom line is Duke should have done his homework and he would have known the lead player does not get the spotlight in Dylan's band....



I don't think that's the bottom line at all...Duke played plenty of solos during the spring and whether or not you believe him that "I couldn't seem to do anything wrong" the fact that he was hired back for the summer tour suggests he wasn't doing too badly.


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PostPosted: Tue July 28th, 2015, 16:57 GMT 

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Lily Rose wrote:
Unless you can time travel and have the ability to hide in the corner with no one noticing you are not going to get any of the players telling the details, and then everyone can only tell you the story from THEIR point of view..... but.... Duke has put out a song called 'Svengali' (a way of saying someone who controls)..... and dedicated it to Bob..... does seem like someone thinks Bob is too controlling....... yep, back to the horse is dead, stop kicking it.... let it fade away... :roll:

For some reason it seems like this is a good place to say Denny Freeman is a class act 8)


If it really was purely a matter of not being content with the style of music, then isn't it extremely likely that Duke have waited until the end of the tour leg before quitting?

He would have maintained his professionalism, would have garnered more sympathy with some, and most significantly, would have been a lot better off financially. Instead, he is moved to quit just a few days into a tour leg, despite the huge downsides of doing so. Whatever happened, it seems safe to say that something must have really upset him to make this sort of decision. Would you quit a high-paid job at very short notice just because of a minor upset?


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PostPosted: Tue July 28th, 2015, 17:29 GMT 

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The spring shows were great (after the somewhat slow start in Buffalo). I also happened to be at the Atlanta show to witness things coming to a head on stage. I hope this thread never dies.


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PostPosted: Tue July 28th, 2015, 17:34 GMT 

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notdarkyet wrote:
it also could be that those guys see that being a supporting character in the stage performance of the greatest artist of both our and their lifetimes, assisting him to create the musical sound he is going for, is in the long run a far greater achievement than trying to steal his show and making a name for yourself

smoke wrote:
For musicians of this caliber, it may be more interesting and even fun to engage in the subtle and improvisational interplay this band offers than it would be to crank out the same kind of blues-rock solos they did at age 16. This is surely more true for some than others, depending on the role they play, but it wouldn't surprise me if they all felt this way to some degree.

if it´s like that, Beethoven on stage could bandmembers always remind: We´re not any band that has more or less fun – we do an earnest musical thing, that sometimes is boring, frustrating and ascetic. But in the long run it´s a piece of art that brings deeper satisfaction than anything else. If you want that, you have to subordinate yourself not under anybody, but under people like Beethoven, who have to conduct with the authority of a genius.
I would like if the band thinks that way – as long as the shows are … interesting. Sure they do only a job, but musicians like them could make money elsewhere if the job is too ugly. So why Duke Robillard had to go? May he has more musical identity but a more limited idea of music. But this now are just bubbles in the wind.


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PostPosted: Tue July 28th, 2015, 17:46 GMT 
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I wonder if the Duke incident will motivate him to keep this steady lineup with him right up to the end of it all


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PostPosted: Tue July 28th, 2015, 21:39 GMT 
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A Merry Llama wrote:
I wonder if the Duke incident will motivate him to keep this steady lineup with him right up to the end of it all


I can't see him using other people. Just really can't. Especially drums and bass, especially.


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PostPosted: Wed July 29th, 2015, 03:49 GMT 
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why hasn't anyone emailed Duke himself and flat out asked him what happened? :P

i'm getting curiouser and curiouser whether he has information that may save our souls :lol:

he doesn't have to be specific, he can pick from bad-boss tropes :lol:


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PostPosted: Wed July 29th, 2015, 07:34 GMT 

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bobschool wrote:
why hasn't anyone emailed Duke himself and flat out asked him what happened? :P

that would be against the rules. And nobody knows if he really knows it. We are there to figure out :D


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PostPosted: Wed July 29th, 2015, 08:23 GMT 
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It was probably more Duke's smiling that did for him as much as his soloing.


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PostPosted: Wed July 29th, 2015, 13:36 GMT 
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Kle wrote:
bobschool wrote:
why hasn't anyone emailed Duke himself and flat out asked him what happened? :P

that would be against the rules. And nobody knows if he really knows it. We are there to figure out :D

Yeah, really.... what the heck do we need with facts :lol: It is way more fun to just discuss it without any real clues except the results (Duke left, Charlie back)... and the little that was seen on stage (Duke solo, Dylan pissed leaning on the keyboards :shock: )

Besides, that really is not fair..... Duke would give us his point of view of what happened, fermented over a couple of years..... and he would do that knowing that the Dylan side would not be discussed by Dylan or his crew..... Everyone can only tell you about the world around them and things that have happened from their own point of view..... this is true about everything that happens, not just this..... It will be interesting to see who lives the longest and gets to write the last book from someone who was there..... History is written by the winners... or in this case the last one standing...... I have a feeling it is going to be Dylan him self some how..... Hey, after that concert where the lightning started flashing at an outside venue just as he started Thunder on the Mountain, I think he can figure anything out 8)

So let's get back down to the speculation and the gossip level with this....Hey, anybody think we could start a campaign to get this song put on the pool? :wink:


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PostPosted: Wed July 29th, 2015, 16:40 GMT 

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Lily Rose wrote:
Besides, that really is not fair..... Duke would give us his point of view of what happened, fermented over a couple of years..... and he would do that knowing that the Dylan side would not be discussed by Dylan or his crew.....


So basically even if Duke told his side of the story, you wouldn't believe him?

If, hypotheticly, Bob or someone from his camp not directly involved came forward with a story, would you believe that version? Just wonderin'!

What *I* really wanna know is why Charlie came back - and stayed.


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PostPosted: Wed July 29th, 2015, 17:05 GMT 

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Oneofusmustknow wrote:
A Merry Llama wrote:
I wonder if the Duke incident will motivate him to keep this steady lineup with him right up to the end of it all


I can't see him using other people. Just really can't. Especially drums and bass, especially.


I believe Bob has already answered that question for you: The current line-up of the band existed from 2009 to 2012 already, then Charlie left and Bob just replaced him with Duke. When Charlie wasn't available for some of the Summer '13 shows, Bob replaced him with Colin Linden, who wasn't even his first choice.

Yes, it would be a bit awkward to see Bob without Tony at this point, but I think it would be doubtful that Bob would cut his artistic career short just because a bass player he doesn't even care to introduce on stage would have to resign from the band.

I think it would be fair to say that he has no plans to get rid of any of his current musicians any time soon (and it has been that way for a while now, Denny Freeman being the only one fired in about 15 years), but if they decide to leave, he'll replace them without missing a beat.


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PostPosted: Wed July 29th, 2015, 21:35 GMT 

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Handsomeinthefog wrote:
I think it would be fair to say that he has no plans to get rid of any of his current musicians any time soon (and it has been that way for a while now, Denny Freeman being the only one fired in about 15 years), but if they decide to leave, he'll replace them without missing a beat.


for me it was irritating that Dylan liked to have one standard band for shows and for the studio not only in a special phase of his career but seemingly open end. I thought of him as an artist who is free to change his musicians like the style of his recordings. I felt sad about all the opportunities that could have been realized with other bands. Nowadays – after a long time without sensationel changes but with success - I believe the family band Garnier and Co is very important for his productivity and the quality of the newer recordings. Yes, he easily can change a musician, but I believe he can´t change too often. Otherwise he would lose continuity and that steady band structure he envied from the Beatles or Grateful Dead. The Dead didn´t want him as a member, when he asked for, because for them he was a leader. So he created his own club (first with other leaders called the Traveling Wilburys). May the current members feel how important they are and so many things look better for them as it seems from outside.
The following step of continuity was the Set.


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PostPosted: Wed July 29th, 2015, 22:35 GMT 
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lovethatcountrypie wrote:
The spring shows were great (after the somewhat slow start in Buffalo). I also happened to be at the Atlanta show to witness things coming to a head on stage. I hope this thread never dies.

The Spring Duke shows are fondly remembered.
A lot of people thought the crowd was 'booing' when actually we were screaming "Duke! Duke! Duke!"
Rumors of guitar techs grabbing axes back stage and then the realization that 'axes' referred to guitars.


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PostPosted: Thu July 30th, 2015, 16:23 GMT 

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Kle wrote:
for me it was irritating that Dylan liked to have one standard band for shows and for the studio not only in a special phase of his career but seemingly open end. I thought of him as an artist who is free to change his musicians like the style of his recordings.


I see why you would think that, but it's not entirely true.

Yes, in the past 20 years more and more of his live musicians have cropped out on his records, but even then he has replaced both of his touring band guitarists on the two 2009 albums and usually had extra people like David Hidalgo or keyboard players coming in. I guess he did that because he wanted a bit of a different sound - and especially on "TTL" it worked, for better or worse.


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PostPosted: Fri July 31st, 2015, 11:07 GMT 

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thanks for breaking it to the facts. For me since „Love and theft“ the feeling of a club became stronger with the climax of the the last two records.


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PostPosted: Fri July 31st, 2015, 17:33 GMT 
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Handsomeinthefog wrote:
Lily Rose wrote:
Besides, that really is not fair..... Duke would give us his point of view of what happened, fermented over a couple of years..... and he would do that knowing that the Dylan side would not be discussed by Dylan or his crew.....


So basically even if Duke told his side of the story, you wouldn't believe him?

If, hypotheticly, Bob or someone from his camp not directly involved came forward with a story, would you believe that version? Just wonderin'!

What *I* really wanna know is why Charlie came back - and stayed.

Just saw this....

First question.... My point is that Duke knows he can say anything he wants because Bob has not and will not be talking about it. This is not to say that Duke would not tell the truth.... as he knows it from his point of view....

Second question... Same thing as Duke.... everyone will tell the story from their point of view..... and actually who believes whatever of whomever.... really doesn't matter

Third..... Do we really know why Charlie left? Do we know why Charlie came back? And as far as staying.... obviously because he wants to..... ..... I really think there is a great personal attachment between Bob and Charlie. I say this for a couple of reason..... I saw how excited they were on that concert in Austin when Charlie came on stage.... they really seem to enjoy being on stage together..... Second, when Duke left, Charlie was there for Bob.... He could not have had time to give that too much thought..... 'Charlie, I need your help'....'No problem, heading to the airport now, on my way'. But then that is just my point of view.... :P


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PostPosted: Sat August 1st, 2015, 01:33 GMT 

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Lily Rose wrote:

Third..... Do we really know why Charlie left? Do we know why Charlie came back? And as far as staying.... obviously because he wants to..... ..... I really think there is a great personal attachment between Bob and Charlie. I say this for a couple of reason..... I saw how excited they were on that concert in Austin when Charlie came on stage.... they really seem to enjoy being on stage together..... Second, when Duke left, Charlie was there for Bob.... He could not have had time to give that too much thought..... 'Charlie, I need your help'....'No problem, heading to the airport now, on my way'. But then that is just my point of view.... :P


I was at Charlie's last show in '02 and Bob was making a point to show how he was going to miss Charlie, he was smiling and laughing with him a lot during some songs. Charlie even played Bob's keyboard with his foot during High Water. Bob laughing and lovin it. They're obviously really good friends.


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PostPosted: Sat August 1st, 2015, 09:37 GMT 

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Lily Rose wrote:
Third..... Do we really know why Charlie left? Do we know why Charlie came back? And as far as staying.... obviously because he wants to..... ..... I really think there is a great personal attachment between Bob and Charlie. I say this for a couple of reason..... I saw how excited they were on that concert in Austin when Charlie came on stage.... they really seem to enjoy being on stage together..... Second, when Duke left, Charlie was there for Bob.... He could not have had time to give that too much thought..... 'Charlie, I need your help'....'No problem, heading to the airport now, on my way'. But then that is just my point of view.... :P


The reason for Charlie leaving that we know of is the new band he wanted to start (which never made it past the demo-ing stage) and probably some more personal stuff, considering how unhappy he looked in 2012.


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PostPosted: Sat August 1st, 2015, 13:13 GMT 
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Handsomeinthefog wrote:

The reason for Charlie leaving that we know of is the new band he wanted to start (which never made it past the demo-ing stage) and probably some more personal stuff, considering how unhappy he looked in 2012.

....again we don't know why Charlie left in in the first place.


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PostPosted: Sat August 1st, 2015, 18:27 GMT 
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Hell, we don't even truly know why Duke left.


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PostPosted: Mon August 3rd, 2015, 16:41 GMT 
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Lily Rose wrote:
The last time I went to a Dylan concert I walked out thinking..... Wow, that is one hell of a band... that was some great music.... what a great show.... I think many players that work with major stars end up way more into a certain groove, night after night.... That is unless Jerry G. is back.... I saw one very, very great guitar player, one on the charts, while still in Austin.... a second time seeing him, had seen him a couple years before in Ohio..... At one point he hit his part with a long drawn part where the main player took over and everyone just waited.... there was a very long note he was singing (almost scream like).... I saw the bass player pick up his water bottle, unscrew it, take a big long drink, put the cap back on and put it back and then get his hands back in place to play..... the bass player knew exactly how long he was going to have to get that drink of water..... so if you had a choice of the same exact thing night after night, or sticking to the boss like glue for your next cue which would you pick.

Let's face it, Dylan can't win for losing..... either we sit out here in cyber land and complain that the set list doesn't change, or a good many people are walking out of the show saying.... 'that didn't sound like the record, what were those songs?" :lol:

To me the bottom line is Duke should have done his homework and he would have known the lead player does not get the spotlight in Dylan's band.... there is only one showboat on that stage and his name is on the sign out front.

I guess if he would start listening to other people about how he should direct his band (or sing a song) then he might have managed to have a long, successful, world-wide admired, quoted in the most surprising places, music career.... :wink:


Coming soon to a town near you!:
Stu's Noodle
and some other guys doing stuff. Don't you Dare Miss it!!!


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